Is anybody else having trouble with really nasty smelling beef knuckles? We've had the same problem at three different places I've worked. At some point we discovered that it was mostly, if not entirely, one packer in particular. I won't mention Swift's name but it's a shame because otherwise they are the nicest biggest and meatiest with the nicest color out there. We will open a case and 4 or 5 out of 6 or 7 will be fine but 1 or 2 will be just room clearing awful! I've heard guys compare them to a baby diaper smell but I've changed a few diapers in my day and never had one THAT bad! Saturday I cut a case with two of them in it. They were only 10 days after pack date so it's not like they were old. We aired them out in the cooler for a while and it seemed to take the edge off a little so we cut them. Today we got some back from a store employee who had bought some. I've seen guys chunk one up and throw it in a hopper full of grind and that's a baaad idea too! Then you have 250 lbs. of stinky grind! They come from our corporate warehouse so there is no "sending back" . I just want to know... what the hell is that smell?!! lol Anybody else know what I'm talking about or is it just us lol. If so what are you doing with them? We've noticed they are always real nice looking with that bright orangey color. I've also heard guys say "they were probably cryovaced while they were still warm" No way that can't be true. Even if the packer wanted to the feds would never allow that... would they? These are choice, don't believe they were angus but choice for sure. Anyone with any similar experiences or have any idea what might be causing this? If they get to 3 or 4 wks out of pack date oh boy! Better get some candles ha! One boss used to put cinnamon on the hot plate lol Man it's a glamorous job, don't know why there aren't more people signing up!
I think what you're describing is called sour bone. I've posted about sour bone before, but no one could answer my question "what causes it?". I don't think it's because the knuckles are old. They smelled bad from day one. The entire case would stink if it was the age. And other things would smell that way too. Why is it only (99% of the time) knuckles? Whatever sour bone is, it's usually worst in the knuckle, but I've seen it in forequarters too. I hope you threw them away rather than trying to save it in any way you could think of such as grinding. Have you noticed that the more you cut it, the more it stinks? Meaning, you can't cut out a bad section and save the rest.
In an Internet search, one result said sour bone is from trying to save the meat from an animal that died, maybe overnight, and was discovered the next day. The insides began to spoil and everything should have been thrown away, but they sold the meat anyway. This is illegal BTW. I highly doubt this is going on in USA wholesale meat industry. The Internet search said it's usually a mistake hunters make. Not gutting their game soon enough. I don't think the sour bone we've seen is from this.
I don't know about this one either, but someone told me that some wholesalers open a little space where the femur bone ends. Right in that socket where it fits into the aitch bone. The used a compressed gas of some kind and sometimes that contaminates the hindquarter in that area. That would explain why it's always in the knuckle, but I don't believe this one either.
After reading The Jungle and knowing that corporate America is still driven by greed, it would not surprise me one bit if they are still cutting corners and butchering cattle that had been dead for a day. I am sure they still have little tricks up their sleeves to get around the legal aspect of it. There are also matters of employees screwing up and taking steps to cover up their mistakes because they fear being terminated.
I have experienced this smell before too, but usually with Bone In pork loins, boneless pork loins or bone in pork butts. When you are standing right next to it, it doesn't seem so bad until walk away and you realize the stench has spread throughout the room and beyond. It then gets so overpowering that you might gag or even throw up. I was told before that it was oxidation. In one shop I worked at the cheap skate owners made us rinse it off in the sink and still cut and sell it. That resulted in some very unhappy customers.
It wold always be just parts of the case too. For example a 90 pound case of 4 boneIn pork loins (2 to a pack) would have one loin that had this god awful smell to it. You could separate the second loin from it and that second loin would be fine. I eventually convinced the owners to just let me chuck the nasty loin with out even trying to fix it. I did not want to even touch it. My suspicion was that it was rotten to the core, but no one has been able to confirm that for me either.
In a new Internet search tonight for sour bone, I found some results for "bone sour". It seems like this happens a lot to hunters. Here's two posts and a link to where I found them. What they're writing about is exactly what I've seen in some beef. But how does it happen to the beef we see in our retail jobs?
BTW, in the late 70's and early 80's I cut lots of wild game in the market where I worked. I have never seen this in wild game. Maybe it's the area where I live. Maybe deer season is in a cooler part of the year out here in Ca. Maybe California hunters are better than east coast hunters? (just kidding)
Post #1 The only thing worse than losing a wounded elk is bone sour. You did everything right,called in your elk,made a great shot,and found your elk in a short amout of time.But you decide to get help from your partner,and return a couple hours later to break the animal down.It's 80 degrees, and he is laying in the sun,and doesn't cool off fast enough,as you soon find out as you start skinning the animal, and find the meat has turned green from the bone out...... Bone sour! Bone sour happens when the animal isn't cooled down fast enough,and bacteria start growing at a geometric rate,from the bone out,and turns the meat green, and ruins it. This is a huge waste,and is mostly avoidable,even in 80 degrees. By far, the most important thing to do is cool the animal down by skinning, and taking the qtrs.off ASAP. Even in 80 degrees,the meat will cool enough to help deter bone sour,and by getting the meat in the shade and or down to a creek,will help cool the meat further. Bone sour usually happens first in the neck, and in the hams,and these ereas should be given attention first. Elk are big animals, and the first time you walk up on one,you might feel overwhelmed at what to do next. This is not the time to start asking questions,you should have a good idea what to do before you leave home.
post #2
Very good point! Actually an hour or two shouldn't make the difference. But the fact remains getting that elk dismantled asap is the number one priority.
Once bone sour sets in there is not turning back. One thing to remember is that since it starts from the bone and works it's way out if you see any green tint on the outside you can be sure the meat is all lost. Also... once bone sour begins, cooling the meat won't stop it. It will continue to sour even after you quarter the elk so by all means... be prepared to field dress your animal as soon as you recover it. Going for help does NOT help in the long run.
-- Edited by Burgermeister on Tuesday 30th of June 2015 03:16:05 AM
Yes I did a lot of deer processing and have come across "bone sour" animals many times! It's one of the things that drove me away from that business. It happens a lot in the October bow and arrow season or if it gets unseasonably warm in November. People just don't have the sense of urgency they should after they take that shot! That is a very distinct smell though and unlike what we've encountered with the knuckles. It's definitely equally nasty though! I guess anything is possible but I just can't imagine inspectors letting that slide.
I think it has to do something with genetics and the cooling rate. I have heard some folks open up the hind, to help with the chilling process.
that sounds believable. Whatever the case may be, it seems pretty obvious it is a packer problem (that becomes our problem) and it's not a new one. I find it hard to believe they are not aware of it and it blows my mind that they can't remedy the thing somehow! I asked a rep of the aforementioned packer back in February about it and of course he said he's never heard of any such thing. Isn't that always the case? "Oh nobody else has complained" Yeah ok whatever ha lol.
Yes I did a lot of deer processing and have come across "bone sour" animals many times! It's one of the things that drove me away from that business. It happens a lot in the October bow and arrow season or if it gets unseasonably warm in November. People just don't have the sense of urgency they should after they take that shot! That is a very distinct smell though and unlike what we've encountered with the knuckles. It's definitely equally nasty though! I guess anything is possible but I just can't imagine inspectors letting that slide.
So you're saying sour bone is different from bone sour? They are both real bad, equally nasty, but different?
California deer aren't very big. So I guess they're easier and quicker to dress out. Maybe that's why I've never seen it in deer.
Yes I did a lot of deer processing and have come across "bone sour" animals many times! It's one of the things that drove me away from that business. It happens a lot in the October bow and arrow season or if it gets unseasonably warm in November. People just don't have the sense of urgency they should after they take that shot! That is a very distinct smell though and unlike what we've encountered with the knuckles. It's definitely equally nasty though! I guess anything is possible but I just can't imagine inspectors letting that slide.
So you're saying sour bone is different from bone sour? They are both real bad, equally nasty, but different?
California deer aren't very big. So I guess they're easier and quicker to dress out. Maybe that's why I've never seen it in deer.
I'm guessing they are one in the same but I'm not sure I've only heard it called "bone sour". It is more the time it takes to reach the downed animal in warm weather. California hunters are probably more "tuned in" to the issue being from a warmer climate. Quite often it is right at dusk when the animal is shot and usually they don't drop right there it's amazing how far a deer can run without a heart or with a pierced lung not to mention a wound in a less vital organ. Too many hunters will wait until daylight to track their prey. Not so bad if it's below 40...not so good if its in the 50's or 60's lol.
I find most of the time the tip smells in the spring of the year. I have ask this question many times in our meat meetings with the reps. I never get a really good answer but the most of the time they tell us that the animal could have been killed while in heat. We need to ask the big guy, Leon Where are U.
I find most of the time the tip smells in the spring of the year. I have ask this question many times in our meat meetings with the reps. I never get a really good answer but the most of the time they tell us that the animal could have been killed while in heat. We need to ask the big guy, Leon Where are U.
Idk sounds like they're feeding us a line cause these knuckles are not bulls or cows but castrated steers so heat wouldn't be an issue. And yeah where the heck is Leon on this one he MUST be doin his research to give us the absolute straight and correct answer!! I'll be here.
After reading all these post, I have encountered the same thing. There is a old man I know rather well and is a farmer and wheeles & deals cattle too. I'v talked to him on occasions about the matter of smelly meat, and he always said it was caused by a fever the animal has at the time of slaughter . I'm beginning to think he's right
It may be from bulls. yes, they send breading bull to slaughter! I live not to far away from a breeding service( Sire Power) here in tunkhannock, pa. they send there bulls to cargill in wyalusing pa. I know for a fact that an uncasterated bull or bore hog, the meat is strong tasting
After reading all these post, I have encountered the same thing. There is a old man I know rather well and is a farmer and wheeles & deals cattle too. I'v talked to him on occasions about the matter of smelly meat, and he always said it was caused by a fever the animal has at the time of slaughter . I'm beginning to think he's right
There you go that could be... but there again the USDA is supposed to be going over the animal for any sign of sickness even dissecting the brain. Idk it's looking more and more like Leon's gonna have to bail us out on this one! lol
It may be from bulls. yes, they send breading bull to slaughter! I live not to far away from a breeding service( Sire Power) here in tunkhannock, pa. they send there bulls to cargill in wyalusing pa. I know for a fact that an uncasterated bull or bore hog, the meat is strong tasting
yeah definitely they slaughter bulls but these are choice knuckles not bull knucks. And yeah I processed wild boar omg they are disgusting and to me they taste just like they smell! Idk how people eat em.
I find most of the time the tip smells in the spring of the year. I have ask this question many times in our meat meetings with the reps. I never get a really good answer but the most of the time they tell us that the animal could have been killed while in heat. We need to ask the big guy, Leon Where are U.
So what do you do with them when you get em'? Send em back, pitch em or is there something else you try and do with them? I doubt that they are rotten, they're not dark and they don't smell like the typical rotting meat lol but twice I have put strong smelling meat in electric skillet, once was breakfast sausage made from wild boar and once was a deer that laid overnight in mild fall weather. Both times it tasted just like it smelled, but.....both times they were being processed for someone who wanted them processed, even after I advised against it, and both times when asked later they said the meat was fine! Go figure. Guess it always tastes good if you shoot it yourself! ha lol. I've seen guys put some pretty shaky looking and smelling, pork in sausage and never get complaints, returns etc and they will sample it out and workers snacking on it all day and never a problem! So where do you draw the line? Maybe someone needs to invent a stink-o-meter lol! When it gets to 10 on the stink-o-meter ya gotta throw it away! ha!
I find most of the time the tip smells in the spring of the year. I have ask this question many times in our meat meetings with the reps. I never get a really good answer but the most of the time they tell us that the animal could have been killed while in heat. We need to ask the big guy, Leon Where are U.
The big guy just posted above the answer gave to me by George Wolfer a retired Government Inspector Click on the link, it will give the answer
I find most of the time the tip smells in the spring of the year. I have ask this question many times in our meat meetings with the reps. I never get a really good answer but the most of the time they tell us that the animal could have been killed while in heat. We need to ask the big guy, Leon Where are U.
The big guy just posted above the answer gave to me by George Wolfer a retired Government Inspector Click on the link, it will give the answer